A thought on MLK Jr. day.
Most parents want their children to get to know classmates of other races. Is it a problem that some city students feed into schools with very little racial diversity, leaving students with no diverse alternative unless they have the GPA and the luck to get into a magnet? Should there be a "diversity alternative" for those students who seek a more diverse school experience?
80 comments:
Diversity= One thing it should start with the board members to encourage DIVERSITY in the PPS dist.lets start with a protcol
have a diversity workshop discussion topic of diversity across PPS at every level
teach diversity one example more of diverse student activities
higher ethnic teachers of different background
PPS should also promote diversity
have a compliance such as school policies and procedures to meet that goal
meaning to
1. decide on a policy
2. implement a policy
3. enforce compliance of that policy
in which you can have diversity with students,staff,teachers, etc.all the schools in whatever communities they are located
we have to start somewhere.or do we still have that apartheid mentality
You've got to be joking, right. Apartheid? This is not the 1980's.
Last time I checked, this is the USA, the land of opportunity for anyone who works hard and does not give up.
Not sure if it would be wise to endorse any more choices in offerings at this time. How much demand exists for a school based solely on diversity? What goals are set for attaining an acceptable level of diversity and who decides if the goal is attained? Obviously racial diversity is worthy, but frankly public schools everywhere do a poor job of incorporating other aspects of the diversity issue. I personally would like to see kids exposed to a wider range of religions and cultures. Can diversity advances begin there?
This issue is bigger than what can be covered successfully on a blog. If you would look at a racially balanced urban high school and see an all (or close to all) African-American boys' basketball team or a swim team that was largely comprised of caucasian kids wouldn't it be possible to begin diversity advances there?
The idea wouldn't be a school based solely on diversity. Rather, it would be that if a student is assigned to a school that is not diverse (say more than 85 or 90% one race), and there is space at a diverse school, the student could attent the diverse school.
Diversity
Westinghouse? No diversity, PPS is supporting Defacto Segregation. The school is not going attract kids from other parts of the district.
Especially because, Derrick Lopez stated that the school "is for African Americans."
But African Americans who don't want to go the school that is "for" them should have other options.
Diversity???????
There is "diversity" at Allderdice. How has the status of "diversity" benefitted African American students?
There is a 47% Achievement Gap!
The same situation exists with "diversity" at Colfax.
There is a 44% Achievement Gap!
(And believe it or not, this is a white blogger.)
But what is the achievement gap between students at Westinghouse and students at Allderdice? Or even between AA students at Westinghouse and AA students at Allderdice? Not to mention the fact that not all forms of achievement are measured by standardized test results.
The question previously inferred was "How has "diversity" in PPS been an advantage to African American students?
Studies have shown that one of the best ways to combat prejudice is for people to get to know individuals of other races.
Regarding test scores, AA students in general are doing better at diverse schools than they are at non-diverse schools.
Explain "better" when you state that African American students are doing ?"better" at "diverse" schools.
Cite the evidence for WHY they are doing "better" if you have evidence or assert your opinion, but claim it.
See the A+ schools report. The rate of proficiency for AA students in math, for example, is 5 times greater at Allderdice and Langley than at Westinghouse, and also several times greater at Brashear and Carrick than at Westinghouse. But again, the reasons for seeking diverse schools go beyond standardized tests.
I'm not Questioner, but here are the AA test takers' test scores, from the A+ schools booklet, for the high schools. I've put them roughly in order of scores and included % AA & white and % free/reduced lunch. (let me know if I screwed up any numbers between all the copying, and copying and pasting!
I'd say two schools stand out comparatively -- Schenley for their higher scores and Carrick for their lower.
Schenley (71% AA, 21% white, 59% free/reduced lunch):
AA Reading at proficient or advanced:
54.6%
AA Math at proficient or advanced:
44.5%
Langley (64% AA, 28% white, 81% free/reduced lunch):
AA Reading at proficient or advanced:
36.8%
AA Math at proficient or advanced:
29.1%
Allderdice (37% AA, 55% white, 43% free/reduced lunch):
AA Reading at proficient or advanced:
37.1%
AA Math at proficient or advanced:
27.6%
Perry (66% AA, 30% white, 70% free/reduced lunch):
AA Reading at proficient or advanced:
43%
AA Math at proficient or advanced:
19%
Brashear (36% AA, 55% white, 62% free/reduced lunch):
AA Reading at proficient or advanced:
22.1%
AA Math at proficient or advanced:
18.9%
Peabody (93% AA, 4% white, 81% free/reduced lunch):
AA Reading at proficient or advanced:
24.2%
AA Math at proficient or advanced:
18.7%
Carrick (37% AA, 58% white, 76% free/reduced lunch):
AA Reading at proficient or advanced:
21.6%
AA Math at proficient or advanced:
18.8%
Oliver (83% AA, 13% white, 82% free/reduced lunch):
AA Reading at proficient or advanced:
20.3%
AA Math at proficient or advanced:
15.5%
Westinghouse (98% AA, 0% white, 86% free/reduced lunch):
AA Reading at proficient or advanced:
28.8%
AA Math at proficient or advanced:
5.4%
Concentration of impoverished students also affects performance.
In addition to ethnic diversity is (more importantly) socio-enonomic diversity. No, poor children will not become smarter or necessarily learn better by sitting next to a middle class child. But opportunities in the form of more parent involvement, better resources in the school, better opportunities for broadening their worlds, possibilities for for summer employment/internships all increase if poor children go to a school with an socio-economically diverse population.
Evidence??? of Benefits??? for Diversity??? Hmmm.
While the "achievement gap" at the district level is nearly 40% for high school students, A+ Schools cites the gap at 50% and further states that it will take PPS 40 years to close the gap.
Agreed that "standardized test scores" are not the only evidence of achievement or benefits.
Please note that "standardized test scores" were never mentioned by anyone except Questioner.
What are the other benefits of "diversity" for African American students, specifically
Test scores were mentioned in response to Anonymous's 2:21 reference to an achievement gap of various specified percentages, presumably measured by standardized tests such as the PSSA. Benefits to students of diverse schools including getting to know and feel comfortable with peers of different races and from different backgrounds. It is up to individual families to gauge how important these benefits are to them, but they should certainly be given the opportunity to choose a diverse environment.
Sounds like "equity" is only possible with "diversity." Why is that the case?
Are you saying that "resources", "opportunities" and "broadening their worlds" is only possible if there are white children in a school?
Shocking statements here, all, but perhaps very revealing.
"Standardized test scores" were not mentioned in the 2:21 statement.
Yes, but reference to test scores was in response to Anonymous's 2:21mention of achievement gaps of various specified percentages, presumably measured by standardized tests such as the PSSA. It's not worth quibbling over.
SolutionsRUs just said that various types of opportunities tend to increase when schools have more socioeconomic diversity.
I do think my child's world was broadened by going to a school with kids of other races.
Thank you 4:43 for providing the evidence that proves the point being addressed. Diversity at all schools mentioned (except Schenley which is being exited) shows the Achievement of African Americans is even LOWER than at Westinghouse.
The benefits of "diversity" at work!?!
The capacity to answer, directly, the questions asked is a skill not yet acquired by some.
Answering questions with questions, opinions, assumptions, and diversionary statements are evasions, and sometimes missed by trusting readers.
Sounds like "equity" is only possible with "diversity." Why is that the case?
Are you saying that "resources", "opportunities" and "broadening their worlds" is only possible if there are white children in a school?
Shocking statements here, all, but perhaps very revealing.
Just to be clear, are you arguing for "separate but equal" and for exactly which groups?
Diversity at all schools mentioned (except Schenley which is being exited) shows the Achievement of African Americans is even LOWER than at Westinghouse.
What are you talking about? Westinghouse's reading scores this year were still low, even if they put them middle of the pack, and their math scores were rock bottom.
In order of reading scores:
Schenley
Perry
Allderdice
Langley
Westinghouse
Peabody
Brashear
Carrick
Oliver
In order of math scores:
Schenley
Langley
Allderdice
Peabody/Brashear/Carrick
Oliver
Westinghouse
Also, there's a "Promise Ready Eligible" ranking for each of the high schools:
For Black students here's what they report:
Allderdice 52.3%
Brashear 34.3%
Carrick 34.8%
Langley 20.9%
Oliver 37.1%
Peabody 27.8%
Perry 50.8%
Schenley 43%
Westinghouse 24.6%
And we would need to look at graduation rates as well. One reporter pointed out that scores of schools like Westinghouse may be artificially inflated because a higher than average percentage of students drop out.
AA Board members, high level administrators and politicians almost always choose for their own children schools with diverse student populations.
Again, questions to answer questions, just shifting emphasis to evade response. The question is: How are African American students benefitting in the schools that have "diversity" No evidence, yet. The lists provided prove that there is a 60% to 80% lack of achievement for African American students at Carrick, Brashear, Langley, and just slightly more at Allderdice which are the four schools of "diversity."
The only argument being here made is against the proposition that African American students have "equity" or are benefitting from "Diversity" schools, which is the title of this blog.
Sorry, the statement should read "with slightly less" LACK of proficiency at Allderdice, not "slightly more."
Again, all students in diverse schools, including African Americans, are benefiting by having the opportunity to get to know and feel comfortable with peers of different races and often, with different backgrounds. Also, achievement in the form of test scores and Promise readiness is on average higher in diverse schools.
To sum up, different people will have different views on the benefits of diversity. If provided an option, those who see a benefit in diversity can take advantage of it, and those who do not see a benefit can decline the option.
No doubt there are many benefits to "diversity."
The purpose of schools is to EDUCATE all. If the education for African American students is significantly substandard in schools where "diversity" is the purpose, then we have failed in the mission of the school. "Diversity" can and will be accomplished in multiple ways but cannot replace or substitute for an education for African American students.
How can we achieve equity and education for ALL students in diverse schools?
I think the school that was known for having the most diversity -- in that there was less an atmosphere of these kids only know/hang out with these kids and those kids only know/hang out with those kids was found historically at Schenley.
There was a more diverse representation of races, ethnicities (and not to say that there weren't problems for some of the ESL kids there)and a more diverse representation of socioeconomics, as well. Their scores, while still not closing the gap, have for years been on average the best scores in the district for AA kids. Programs that had worked to lessen that gap had worked...but lost funding.
Allderdice has long been known as having "schools within the school" and NOT known for a lot of "mixing."
Look, at Wake County, NC -- they used socioeconomic status as the diversity "tool" and managed to not have schools with concentrated poverty. Scores went up, parents were happy, etc. Currently a new, more conservative school board is trying to end that and go back to closest-school-only type assignments, which would lead to more segregation and more concentrations of poverty and wealth at different schools.
I mean, you can make arguments for segregation if you want (it's a free country) and I don't think anyone here is saying that white kids are required for black kids to learn, or vice versa. But many people chose to live in the city and use the schools BECAUSE of the diversity and will likely leave the district for the same reason -- lack of diversity.
With all the curriculum scripted and declining enrichment opportunities, electives, and standards of behavior, with parents' voices ignored by the administration, why would anyone who can get out stay much longer?
Equity and education for all is of course the goal, but there is no indication that education for African American students is significantly substandard in diverse schools as opposed to all-African American schools. So let's at least give families options.
Unfortunately, in Pittsburgh the "indications" are loud and clear. To state otherwise defies the evidence.
However. no one would disagree there should be options!
What are the options in PPS?
http://www.colbertnation.com/full-episodes/tue-january-18-2011-cornel-west
Start watching about 5 minutes into the show.
Thank you for directing us to this satire of resegregation efforts in North Carolina.
New school board members? Who is new? Conservative? I don't think so. Roosevelt was NOT a conservative nor are the board members who hired him.
If you truly want to know who IS in charge, then check out the American Deception site and the Dumbing Down of America site. Just google.
Are you afraid of the truth?
Reading Comprehension!
Wake County North Carolina.
And like magic -- Colbert then talked about them last night!
Read carefully and keep up!
"New school board members? Who is new? Conservative? I don't think so. Roosevelt was NOT a conservative nor are the board members who hired him.
If you truly want to know who IS in charge, then check out the American Deception site and the Dumbing Down of America site. Just google.
Are you afraid of the truth?"
------------------
No, however the truth scares me. Eli Broad & Bill Gates are clearly in charge.
http://www.indyweek.com/indyweek/an-open-letter-to-wake-school-superintendent-anthony-tata/Content?oid=1965654
Two quotes from the above link that are especially relevant:
"The district pays for "wrap-around" services—supplemental teaching and social services for kids in high-poverty schools... Wrap-arounds help, but expensively, compared with not creating any high-poverty schools."
and, echoing the point Solutions made:
"And listen to students like Monserrat Alvarez, the 18-year old Meredith College freshman .... Alvarez is eloquent about the educational value, for poor kids and rich ones, of attending schools with kids from different backgrounds. For her, the child of an immigrant mom, it was the difference between meeting the people who helped her to succeed and not meeting them. "I am a product of the diversity policy," Alvarez says, "and for this I am extremely grateful."
There may be one or two students like Monserrat Alvarez at Allderdice, Brashear, Carrick and Langley the "DIVERSITY" schools in PPS, what do you say to the 317 African American students at these schools who LACK academic achievement in the range of 70 to 75%?
Ask them if they have benefitted from "diversity." That range of achievement levels rivals Peabody, Oliver and Westinghouse for the LOWEST in the district.
Again, please cite the EVIDENCE of benefit from "diversity" for these students!
As noted above, the A+ report shows that the average achievement level for AA students at diverse schools is higher than the average achievement level for AA students at less diverse schools. And, many, many students from all backgrounds benefit from the greater extracurricular, sports and other opportunities that are available at schools that do not have high concentrations of impoverished students.
While improvement at all schools is needed, there does not seem to be any evidence showing that students are doing as well or beter at the least diverse schools. Certainly those parents in the best position to make a choice are choosing the more diverse schools.
?? There is limited, but clear evidence, that diverse schools do better in Pittsburgh (shall we throw in CAPA? Sci-Tech in a few years?) and no evidence that segregated schools in PGH provide an advantage for AA kids.
Not to mention that there is solid research evidence that racial AND socioeconomic diversity leads to better performance across the country.
What's your evidence to support your view that AA kids are doing better at Peabody or Westinghouse or Oliver? What about Arsenal and King -- are they doing better than more diverse schools as well?
No one is arguing that AA kids are getting a great education in most of the schools here -- right now, I'd say all kids are suffering. But what is your evidence is that PPS have finally figured out how to teach poor, AA kids in segregated schools? UPrep/Milliones? Weil?
Knowing that there are different ways to live, to act, to think, to decide is a valuable lesson for all kids. You get more of those lessons in more diverse schools.
Also keep in mind that the point of the original post was simply that families should be given the OPTION to choose a diverse school. There does not seem to be real disagreement about offering an option. Those that feel diversity is not a benefit can decline the option. At the same time, everyone can continue to work on raising achievement at all schools.
Can anyone cite evidence that shows the "benefits" of "diversity" for the 371 African American students at Allderdice, Brashear, Carrick, and Langley?
That is the question being posed.
None of the comments in the last two blogs answer the question. No varied range of opinions on related issues is needed, just evidence on "benefits" for Black students at the above-mentioned "diversity" schools.
The first para of the 12:35 post does answer this question.
Also note that while no "varied range of opinions" may be needed, a varied range of opinions exists: some people find information such as test results at the different schools (and their own experiences and observations) convincing as to the benefits of diversity, and some do not. The idea would be to respect the conclusions drawn by each family.
Agreed that varied opinions are always needed and are a critical part of the process.
However, let's not move so quickly away from Questions repeated insistence on evidence. Evidence is fact not opinion.
Certainly, "diversity" can be a wonderful component of any enterprise and is such in many schools; but, in PPS non-magnet schools there is no evidence whatsoever that "diversity" has benefitted African American students.
Initially, that was the point of this blog.
How do we get to a reality that "diversity" works for African American students, in general, in PPS schools as opposed to isolated students or isolated schools?
The achievement data referred to above is factual. Most AA students at Allderdice, Schenley and Langley are not part of a magnet, and their PSSA and Promise readiness performance is on average significantly higher than AA students at less diverse schools.
The district does not appear to collect data on other measures such as participation in sports and activities and rates of incoming 9th graders who graduate and so in those areas we must rely on experience and observation.
Additionally,
Questioner: Is it your position that Black students cannot "benefit" or improve academically unless they are in a school with white students?
Shame. Please check the 90-90-90 schools and the Dame-Dame schools. They are evidence that Black students can achieve at the 90th percentiles academically; BUT it is not happening in PPS.
The question is WHY and "diversity" has no evidence that "it" is the answer. aglogeri
No. No one said that black students cannot improve academically unless they are in the presence of white students. It is however difficult to gain the interperdonal benefits of classmates of other races if you have no classmates of other races.
I've not seen anyone argue that white kids NEED black kids to learn or black kids NEED white kids to learn. Nor have I heard it argued that rich kids MUST HAVE poor kids around to learn or poor kids MUST HAVE rich kids.
HOWEVER, I will always argue that having kids together does teach more than things than just the curriculuum. Knowing that there are different ways of living -- without television, with trips to Europe, with 10 people in an apartment, etc. all are experiences that broaden kids' experiences. Are any of them the one necessary thing? Of course not!
I know of kids who have gotten summer jobs and after school jobs because they went to school with kids whose parents owned businesses and hired them. I know of kids who have gotten into programs, camps, and activities that they wouldn't have even known about had they not gone to schools with a mix of kids. Again, these don't go in just one direction (rich to poor or just poor to rich, for instance).
There is exactly ONE school in the PPS district that qualifies at the "bronze" level for Dame-Dame status, down from THREE. It is a school known for its relentless emphasis on "The Test" as well, rather than on learning per se.
There are no 90-90-90 schools in Pittsburgh, much as you might wish them to be.
So, I'd like to see your EVIDENCE that the PPS administration has any clue at all how to run a high quality segregated school with high concentrations of poverty. They had their chance to prove that with UPrep and so far, I'd say the results aren't promising.
And that's not to say that there are any great schools left in the district, diverse or not.
4:40
Agreed.
The point, though, was that there are NO 90-90-90 schools in PPS. However, there SHOULD, COULD, WOULD be if PPS to use your words "had a clue."
Which school is the one bronze Dame-Dame school?
Thanks for your contribution to the blog.
Many African American Students from Allderdice go on to college.
Schools range from Ivy League to CCAC. I have had students at Havard, John Hopkins, Allegeny, W& J, University of Rochester, just to name a few schools. I am not a CAS teacher. Not all my white students go to college. Allderdice has a positive learning enviroment for all students. The Pittsburgh Promise has hopefuly increased the children going on to post secondary schools.
I love the diversity of my school. It benefits kids of all races and social economic status.
This thread is out of control. Really? People are doubting the benefits of diversity in public schools? Are we back in the days of "separate but equal"?
No one is saying that black students cannot excel in an non-diverse environment. We are very aware of the data from 90-90-90 schools. And as was stated earlier, race is just one component of diversity. More important is socio-economic diversity. So let's look at some facts.
1) The African american community has been fighting for decades for diversity in public schools (see Brown vs. Board of Ed)
2) Schools with concentrated poverty in the PPS have less resources and less opportunity for attracting and holding good teachers (and I am not saying that all teachers at these are bad) (see A+ schools School Works research).
3) African american students, on average, fare better in standardized tests at schools that are more diverse.
4) Stereotyping and bigotry, among both the black and white populations, are bred by "fear of the unknown". Students' exposure to different ethnicities and socio-economic backgrounds will help them better be prepared for the very diverse world they will encounter after high school.
In my mind, arguing that diversity in our schools is unimportant is silly. Take a look at what is happening in NC when their school board decided to rescind its diversity policy. Do we really want to go back to the days of Plessy vs. Ferguson?
This blog is moderated fairly and intelligently. The paranoia that seems to be creeping in here boggles my mind. This blog was started blog for one purpose...to connect PPS stakeholders for sharing of ideas and opinions. Nothing is censured except when a post resorts to name-calling. Period. If posters want to believe that there is some other sinister force at work here to squelch the voice of the people, that is certainly their prerogative, but it is simply untrue.
Also remember, that we are not starting from a position of "status quo." We are seeing increasing movement of those AA students who do not qualify for magnets, to less diverse environments. The explanation is that the students are being moved to schools that will "focus" on them. Those that believe the move toward concentrations of high poverty and/or lower achieving students is the wrong step to take would welcome alternatives.
Nothing is censored? See "new policy."
Nothing is censored. Removal of repeated posts of the same material, leaving the original post in place, is not censoring.
It's not censored if it is just repetition!
"Stereotyping", "bigotry", "unimportant","silly", ""paranoia", "sinister" are not considered a form of name-calling? Interesting.
Just a suggestion 5:03.
Have you studied "Brown vs. Board of Education"?
It is more than a notion for dropping into this thread.
Yes, the new policy says it is "removed" (that is censoring) if the Questioner opines that it is "repetition."
Is that subjective "censoring"?
Stating that stereotyping and bigotry still exist in our society is not name calling. A statement that some comments reflect paranoia is not not name calling. In contrast, calling someone (particularly an individual identified by name) an "idiot" is name calling.
If anyone is unhappy with the moderating here- start your own blog! It's free and easy to do.
Please, let us keep this blog about education and education reform, and not about individuals needs to assert themselves or the making of false accusations. I know for a fact that the facilitators of this blog are using their time with only the best intentions, and do not warrant some of the comments by some of the posters.
The road to education is often paved by "best intentions." Unfortunately, that road does not always reach its destination.
It is important to acknowledge that there is not one road to education and we can only hope that an open exploration of all of the issues will improve education destination for African American children in Pittsburgh.
The 6:20 blog is not about education or education reform, is it?
Let's address the educational issues.
The 6:20 post is about our discussion of educational issues, in response to the previous post.
Sometimes we'll have a little housekeeping to do but we try to keep it to a minimum.
12:35
Where, on this blog, did anyone say that Westinghouse, Peabody, Oliver, Uprep, Arsenal of King were doing "better" than in "diversity" schools. Certainly, they are NOT, that was the point. They are doing the same as Black students at Brashear, Carrick, etc.
You mention Weil. So, take a look at Weil 8th grade achievement levels. These students are outperforming the District by about 20 points. This group advanced 50% points from 7th grade to 8th grade (the same group of students.) Congratulations Weil!
Notice: This is NOT a "diversity" school.
Looking at the A+ report page 75, Weil does not seem to be outperforming the district by 20 points. In 8th grade reading, proficiency is essentially at the district average (71.4% v. 70.9%; math is lagging by 16 points (42.1% v. 58%).
8th grade scores increase and are high across the district and the state.
Please use the official data at PAAYP.
What is the District average for Black and/or White students?
Data for Weil -- looks like Questioner's data to me:
http://paayp.emetric.net/School/Performance/c2/102027451/7876
Data for District as a whole:
http://paayp.emetric.net/District/DataTable/c2/102027451
Actually, looking more closely, they look far worse than Questioner's data, but the PAAYP site doesn't clarify what grade they show, or if it's an average.
There are places on the state website to find grade by grade results, but using this website is rather time-consuming. Unless someone finds more than minor errors in the A Plus report, the A Plus report should be adequate for our purposes.
Data for all grades is almost always worse than 8th grade- the 8th grade test may just be easier.
Dear Anon 9:58,
Since you are ever so concerned about "evidence" (and choose to ignore it even when it is presented to you), could you please provide evidence for these slanderous statements made by you about Questioner?
"End-runs, evasions, change of subject, off-point, blinders-on tactics rule, over-riding, ad nauseum, any different point of view that is submitted"
2:13: For each of your concerns, in paragraph 1 and paragraph 2, there is abundant evidence, however to say it here "again" would be "repetitious" and therefore deleted by a censor.
OK, enough sarcasm about censorship. There is no censorship happening. Move on.
From a NYT article this week about charter schools in NYC:
"In September, the district received an $11 million federal grant to try to attract more white children to schools where minorities are the overwhelming majority."
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/01/22/nyregion/22charter.html?pagewanted=2&_r=1
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