On another post Anonymous wrote:
"
new topic please-- CTE programs
http://www.pghcitypaper.com/pittsburgh/technical-difficulties-although-on-the-rise-nationally-career-and-tech-programs-at-city-schools-face-sagging-enrollment-uncertain-future/Content?oid=1734443
This
is the MOST arrogance attitude I've seen from PPS. Sorry folks but
transportation IS an issue. This city has hills/valley/ rivers-- we
built neighborhood schools. T say it isnt a problem for students to take
two buses from East hills to Carrick is insane! Have YOU every taken
two buses in this city? Did you notice-- it has been a rough winter!
Have you been ON a bus when it changed from delay to cancelled? It is an
easy decision to say it is a fine commute in August-- but where were
YOU in December? Spreading these programs around this city is a
difficult problem.
Problem #2-- This has been an area where your
evaluations didnt match up with the fine experienced teachers who had
been running programs. So not only do I take two buses, I get the 5th
substitute/new hire since their "real teacher" got pushed out-- talk to
the kids this is what they say!
Problem #3-- This would have been the
one area where we could have easily competed with charter schools etc.
Remember when parochial schools hauled their kids TO our programs? But
it was cheaper to kill comprehensive middle schools cause basing school
on a 50's motif certainly keeps students in the city NOT! Ask your
suburban friends what is taught in middle schools especially in the area
of CTR
Let's require admin to walk the walk-- or in this case ride the BUSES, adjust the schedule for varying school start times, etc.
The
worst arrogance is the "if they want it they will do" attitude-- these
are hs students-- not adults making life decisions about where they live
and how long their commute is!"
16 comments:
Some valuable thoughts going on here. The idea of taking two buses to get to school for any magnet program is horrible. Public transportation for school aged youngsters is crazy. Sometimes extra buses are added for student use. Adults do not like being on these buses with students.
Having a vocational class with multiple non-certified teachers is not good. The district stands to miss out on federal monies by doing this. When the auditors come through. Excuses will be made. Bottom line, students cannot get vocational credit if the class is not taught by a vocational-certified teacher. By the time they are seniors, it may be too late to make up credits to graduate. If students do not take and pass the NOCTI exam, their programs loose credibility. Eventually, the programs are closed. A 20 year teacher just doesn't up and retire. There is way more to that story I am sure.
As for bussing Middle School or Parochial students, we don't need to worry about that either. Those programs are gone too.
6:37, you said "A 20 year teacher just doesn't up and retire. There is way more to that story I am sure."
Go to the previous Pure Reform thread "The only hope cannot be an experiment". Read the 12:53 post there, and then read the 10:43 post there.
I might be wrong, but I think everyone is talking about the same school.
And for what it's worth, I do not think it's necessary to name the school. And that's because what happened there is certainly not an isolated incident.
Quite a few very good (and very experienced) PPS teachers have been forced to resign, or retire early. Their replacements are inexperienced, and often don't last long. All this has been going on for at least five years now.
So this is not a school problem. It is a school district problem.
Really happy to see this thread start. I know many business owners who got their training while Catholic school students by going to a pps program half day.
Is it true that kids can only get vocational credit if taught by a certified teacher? Could this end up being one more time parents get fooled into thinking their kids are getting something special and it backfires?
Since this article appeared could it be a good bet that there will be a education committee meeting focused on the CTE Dept. offerings?
Does anyone think the article will generate more interest or greater enrollment?
Wouldn't it be better if these programs were capped at 15 students or 20 at the most? 40 in one class is too many.
can we hear from kids who travel? it can't be easy and if a kid does it they'd better be getting the best. is there more than just touring facilities to these partnerships?
College is not for everybody but a lot of kids are convinced that it would be a crime to not take advantage of The Pittsburgh Promise. Could be that the Promise is part of the cause of the lack of interest in vocational programs.
I thought Promise money was available to graduates who attended a vocational school like PTI or Tri-Angle Tech. As for the vocation programing going down, what do you expect. Counselors push the academics. The mentality is 'You can try college, if that don't work, you can always learn a trade' It has been this way for years. When I was in the scholars program, I was told I had to take French or German. Spanish was for the schlubs. The only difference being there were so many more students to fill the vocational programs. My experience as a teacher has been that most kids just don't like to get dirty.
I think the language of the Promise is that it has to result in a "certificate" of some sort-- which is good-- but we still need quality CTE programs at the high school level. Yes there are students that travel, work hard, and take the real exams to join trade unions etc. We need to praise them and get the work out. This was just a perfect storm year-- bad weather, and kids scrambling across the city.
Yes the Promise is for students who want to attend a trade school, but the article specifically mentions two scenarios that do not involve post high school education requiring any Promise money. One, that many students will be able to go to work at a UPMC facility and two, that there is a partnership with a union that improves eligibility for being accepted to the union program after graduation. Neither would seem to require a promise dollar.
Anyone ask about the qualifications of CTE Director and how she went from.... We know the rest. PG article also stated that CTE enrollment is skyrocketing across the US.
My understanding is this, she was a cosmetology teacher. roosevelt promoted her to the position. She did not have the required certificate at the time. There was a white, certified, male with an advanced degree and more years of service who was passed over. That should make no difference at all. We have had mr and ll in the position of superintendent without required certificate. Perhaps roosevelt wanted a person who could put on a good show and be easily controlled.
CTE teachers have been asking that question for some time. She used to be teacher on special assignment as assistant to the past director. No certificate though.
PPS would do itself a favor by looking at the public school partnership in Brooklyn NY with IBM. The school's named is P-Tech. The IBM partnership is a commitment between big business and public schools in preparing students for the world of work in the 21st century. This high school associate degree model is a 6 year program that guarantees students who complete the courses a middle income paying job at IBM. Maybe the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation would serve PPS students better if they would focus on job training skills and make a commitment to hire PPS graduates of the 6 year program a middle class paying job at Microsoft. It's clear that the money their foundation has allocated for teacher development and evaluation is not meeting the needs of the vast majority of our students. Kudos to IBM for working hand in hand with this Brooklyn Public High School as they demonstrate the true meaning of "Excellence For All!"
Looks like there is still plenty of interest in technical education. This is in today's Post Gazette. http://www.post-gazette.com/local/north/2014/03/20/A-W-Beattie-open-house/stories/201403200005
I recall the days when PPS operated a similar school at Connelly and South Vo-Tech. Was there not talk a few years back to put vocational programs into one central location? Was this one of Julia Stewarts many plans that never made it? If students are willing to travel outside their home school district, why won't PPS students. Please don't throw out the usual two busses, high drug/crime areas, conflicts with sports. If a student wants it, they will make it happen. IF IT'S AVAILABLE!
I agree--in that both Connelley and South Votech were virtually " central city" - also these locations made it easy for building trades professionals to teach their skills. In the way back times, these schools ran their programs at alternative times....see we Did do later start times , -- it was called "continuation school" and was designed for non traditional students. But roosevelt and crew decided that we would force college prep on all....and ignore as not mattering, those who wanted a different path. Because of his name branding, the burgh bought this-- instead of saying no prep school boy, our city deserves the same access to training that other districts have!
Still even more interest in career education. This in post gazette. http://www.post-gazette.com/business/employment/2014/03/23/Giving-job-hunters-with-felony-convictions-a-second-chance/stories/201403230033
If only we could get kids interested BEFOREthey get into trouble with the law.
I still feel the bigger problem is that students are being directed to a college education. When that is not achieved, a vocational/trade school is a great alternative. This seems to be the attitude administration and counselors share. Since not every child will be college bound, they should be directed into CTE program in 9th grade. Don't dump a trouble kid into CTE because algebra, chemistry and physics don't cut it.
English, math and science should support a strong vocational program. Not the other way around.
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